New CD Player

Hi Koushik,

Nice buy. Could u plz quote the price?


Rgds

Sourav

Hi Koushik,

Congrats on your buy, just make sure that you use decent quality IC's.

Hi Kousik, congrats on your upgrade.
I heartily endorse SubBoss's recc re upgrading Interconnects.Mostly( perhaps to keepthe unit cost low&competitive), eqpt makers throw in a pathetic quality I/C.
When I picked up Virens'I/C @only Rs 1000, there was a world of a diff in the sound quality-controlled bass, very airy & transparent mids& highs- the music just came alive!
Do check with zhopudey in mumbai abt his experience-he also picked up Virens'I/C.
Finally, enjoy the music-thats what the system is there for!

souravin schrieb:

Hi Koushik, Nice buy. Could u plz quote the price? Rgds Sourav

Paid 16500 inclusive of taxes.

SUB_BOSS schrieb:

Hi Koushik, Congrats on your buy, just make sure that you use decent quality IC's.

Actually the first upgrade I am thinking is better banana plugs for speakers - http://www.designer-audio.com/products/index.htm. I am using their RCA audio I/C cables bought from same dealer from whom I got the other hifi stuff.

Waste of money if you buy from designer audio. Get MX if at all you do want to go with bananas plugs.
I suggest you wire them directly to the speakers and every now and then snip off a bit of the wire(the oxidised part) and reconnect them.

Kamal schrieb:

Do check with zhopudey in mumbai abt his experience-he also picked up Virens'I/C.

Hey that is great;
The next time the Mumbai Chapter is to meet, where ever, please do get that cable along, I would like to put it in any chain and do an A / B to know how good it is.

The Only experiance I have had with Viren's gear is the Mono Block Power Amplifiers that Satyam [forum member] used to use.

Thanks 'Z' for your support.

Bhagwan, do remind Zhopudey do bring Virens' I/C +Speaker cables( not very sure whether Z picked those up also)next time you bombay friends meet; would love to get your impression since apparently you've sampled many cables-I'm sure you wont be biased/swayed by brand names alone unlike most newbies!

Kamal schrieb:

since apparently you've sampled many cables-I'm sure you wont be biased/swayed by brand names alone unlike most newbies!

Interesting Observation !!

None the less, if a cable has a brand or does not have a brand. I do not care. If it is expensive or cheap - that too is of no importance to me. I just need to evaluate its performance. Simple.

I will surely let you know;
My set up only accepts Balanced, but I am sure many other forum members can put in Un Balanced Cables & I could do my listening there.

I will surely wrte about them after I get a chance to listen to them.

Thanks.

Kamal wrote: since apparently you've sampled many cables-I'm sure you wont be biased/swayed by brand names alone unlike most newbies! Interesting Observation !!

A true one, I'm sure!
Looking forward to your evaluation.

Yep, I got his ICs and speaker cables. How do they sound? Well, I have no idea I haven't got my amp yet. My speakers are just expensive showpices right now (well not that good looking either )

I'll love to bring my cables along next time you guys are meeting. Will give me a chance to test them as well (against other cabels).

zhopudey schrieb:

Yep, I got his ICs and speaker cables. How do they sound? Well, I have no idea

Ideally, they shouldn't "sound" at all!!

You know Shahrukh, I would love to agree with you;
The Audiophile in me wants to believe that it is true. Cables SHould Not Be Heard !!!

However, ever one [well almost every one] gets his cable to do the 'equalizer' part in their set up. We say that we are purists, but we use cables as 'tone controls'

I know I will be lambasted for saying this, but at some level we do it - power cables, interconnects, speaker cables, etc. etc.

bhagwan69 schrieb:

You know Shahrukh, I would love to agree with you; The Audiophile in me wants to believe that it is true. Cables SHould Not Be Heard !!! However, ever one [well almost every one] gets his cable to do the 'equalizer' part in their set up. We say that we are purists, but we use cables as 'tone controls' I know I will be lambasted for saying this, but at some level we do it - power cables, interconnects, speaker cables, etc. etc. :Y

I said "ideally..."!

That said, I couldn't agree more with you, Bhagwan. We all (including me) use cables as equalizers in our systems. Quotes like - "I want a warmish sounding I/C", "I'd like siver coated cables because they add that extra zing..." are commonplace - even on this forum - so I don't think you'll get lambasted!

Anyway, I think we are digressing here. Congrats on your new aquisition Kaushik!!

Thanks Shahrukh.

By the way, what's wrong with Designer Audio cable and interconnects. They are priced reasonably. Interconnect cost me Rs.1000 and cable Rs.70/mtr.

I know for a fact that Designer audio (at least in bangalore) gives you speaker cable that has been bought from SP road. Basically speaker cable worth 20 to 30 bucks a meter is sold at 70 or whatever insane amount.

I don't trust the wharfedale dealer in Bangalore. I never received the bill for my diamond 8.4
It has been over 4 years i think now and hell i have been there at least 10 times since i bought it and never received the bill.
It was always one or the other stupid excuse.

Hence, my view is very prejudiced when it comes to designer audio.

Quality, that's all!! I have a pair of thir I/Cs myself. Nothing spectacular. You might as well use the stock ones that come with your CDP!

For decent quality sound at reasonable cost you could have bought Viren’s interconnect / spk cables or Murthy’s entry/mid level interconnect with entry/mid level spk cables from kimber, Qed etc….These are designed keeping audio in mind by people who know what they are doing. I have murthy’s reference interconnects now and I can say for a fact that you need to go very hi-end to beat that one. His mid level interconnect compared very well to a 11k interconnect I tried at home.
If anybody want some used cables from nordost, kimber, murthy’s mid-level interconnect, XLO bi-wire etc.. PM me.
The stuff that local brands like designer audio stocks are some generic cheap stuff which is available all over the place.

square_wave schrieb:

I have murthy’s reference interconnects now and I can say for a fact that you need to go very hi-end to beat that one. His mid level interconnect compared very well to a 11k interconnect I tried at home.

Even I had Murthy's interconnect for sometime at my place (priced around 3.2k). It didnt do much to me. Infact it didnt even beat an ordinary $10 Monster interconnect .Its still a mystery.

I too found no difference with two sets of Murthy's jumper cables for my NAD320BEE..
I had them over for a week each and listened for over 40 hours but no dice.

Then again it also comes down to how good the rest of the system is. If the system is upto it, you would maybe hear some difference.

See if you can get a demo like i got with Murthy;s jumpers..

Hey Abhipani,

What if there are people who can hear the difference ??? It is not a mystery for most of us.

I personally know at least half a dozen seasoned audiophiles with very expensive systems who have sold very expensive interconnects and settled with Murthy’s. A friend is checking out his speaker cables too. His XLO biwire is for sale now

Savyasaachi schrieb:

I too found no difference with two sets of Murthy's jumper cables for my NAD320BEE.. I had them over for a week each and listened for over 40 hours but no dice. Then again it also comes down to how good the rest of the system is. If the system is upto it, you would maybe hear some difference. See if you can get a demo like i got with Murthy;s jumpers..

Agree with Savyasachi.
The system has to resolving enough to let you hear the differences. When I had my wharfedales, the difference the jumper interconnect made was very slight. With the AP 301’s the difference was quite a bit. It had to do with separation of individual sounds and more detail in the highs and airiness. With the valve preamp in place, the difference the interconnects made was huge.

Abhi,
Your source could be the culprit here. And I remember you using some generic OFC cable (MX type) as speaker cables also. If you place bottle-necks like that after the interconnect in the chain, how can you hear differences ?

square_wave schrieb:

What if there are people who can hear the difference ???images/smilies/insane.gif It is not a mystery for most of us.

Abhi, Your source could be the culprit here. And I remember you using some generic OFC cable (MX type) as speaker cables also. If you place bottle-necks like that after the interconnect in the chain, how can you hear differences ?

Ha ha...you have assumed too many things at a time Sir...
Hold your breath, let me explain.

1. I am not one of those Gods who can hear a difference whether its there or not. .
As for my evaluation, when I was not convinced with the interconnect upgrade...I did call upon some very experienced audiophile friends of mine (you know some of them) and even they were of the same opinion, that there was absolutely no improvement...though they did find some flaws in Murthy's interconnect. .

2. At that time I was not using the cheap MX cables you saw the other day. Instead I was using a Audioquest speaker cable and also had Kimber 8TC and VDH on trial basis. All these cables were borrowed and they went back later. So no question of Bottleneck. If you feel only a multi thousand dollars worth speaker cable can bring out the qualities of his interconnect then I didnt have them .

3. If you again made an assumption that my source was not upto the mark to show up the difference the IC makes...ahh..then how come there was so much of difference heard with a DH Labs BL-1, Audioquest King Cobra, VDH D102 MKIII, Audioquest Jaguar (I am using it currently), Tara Labs Prism, Siltech London, TMC, Straightwire EncoreII.... .

All these ICs had showed up their characters in the same setup where I tried Murthy's IC. And I didnt have any surgery to my ears as well. . Except for the DH Labs IC (which sounded clinical), all others were significantly better in my system than the Monsters I was using then.

There is always a way to escape, saying that ICs are system dependant...but Sir, it was nothing more than ordinary in my system and I personally know a dozen audiophiles who felt the same not only in my system but also in their own system.

To each their own……….I would say…….
I have checked out the same TMC, Audioquest Jaguar, Straightwire encore and some others which are more expensive and my findings are quite different. I found the straight wire encore as total crap for the money. The TMC and Audioquest Jaguar DB something (It had a battery strapped to one end) were quite decent. This is compared to murthy’s mid-end interconnect. His reference one is a totally different story.It will have the Jaguars and TMC for breakfast. I recently did a comparison of that one with a 35k something cable in one of our esteemed forum member’s ultra hi-end system and the cable compared very favorably. The forum member also agreed to this. Keep in mind the price difference.
So I feel all these findings are quite system dependant and it also about one’s predisposition to a certain kind of sound.. It would be bad for us to say that something is not good if most find it as quite good. Let each person decide for himself.

Most of the time it is the “BRAND - HAMMER” hammering away in most audiophile’s mind which steers them to branded cables and electronics. It requires a certain kind of “ open mind-set “ to truly appreciate what our own people can do.

square_wave ji, I never said Murthy's ICs are bad. I just said it didnt even beat my $10 Monster IC. Thats all!!!
Why it didnt do it, I dont know .

According to your previous post...the reasons you pointed out are:

1. My ears were not good enough.
2. My source was not good enough.
3. My speaker cables were not good enough.

Few more from my side:

1. My wall colour may not be good enough.
2. My neighbour's wife was not good enough.
3. The channel being played on my TV was not good enough .

Whatever it is...everything can go wrong except those ICs..WOAH WOAH!!!! Actually, the door lock was made of steel..so you see, it totally spoiled the sound otherwise those ICs would have taken me to the heaven .

Most of the time it is the “BRAND - HAMMER” hammering away in most audiophile’s mind which steers them to branded cables and electronics. It requires a certain kind of “ open mind-set “ to truly appreciate what our own people can do.

Are you again assuming something ???
I am not a millionare who can shell out thousands of rupees for something which doesnt have any sonic impact and just a brand. But I also wouldnt touch my wallet for something thats cheap and useless. Its all about VFM. You like a particular cable, go ahead and buy 10 pairs...I didnt like it, I expressed it and bought a different cable (and I couldnt be happier, no cable upgrades now). But you assuming that my evaluation is wrong is a bit too much .
Kab sudhrogey aap??

I didn’t say your evaluation was wrong. I said ‘ TO EACH HIS OWN “. It means what you hear is based on your predisposition to sound and your system. Same with me too. Let others decide for themselves after an audition. Audio has different camps and what works for some may not work for others.

BTW: Thanks for the lovely details of your neighbor’s wife , your steel lock, wall color, channel you watch etc….

I didn’t say your evaluation was wrong.

Then what was this ?

What if there are people who can hear the difference ??? It is not a mystery for most of us.

Your intention was not as hidden as you make it out to be.
If you want to take back your words..you still have a chance.

Do not try to say what is good for others.

Whats wrong in it ?? I am your well wisher after all .
But why are you are flaming!!!
Fire brigade bulao bhai!!!

square_wave schrieb:

you could have bought Viren’s interconnect / spk cables or Murthy’s entry/mid level interconnect with entry/mid level spk cables from kimber, Qed etc….These are designed keeping audio in mind by people who know what they are doing.

Are you saying that Nordost, Kimber, Audioquest, Straightwire, XLO, et all have no idea what they are doing and yet managed to fool so many "seasoned" audiophiles in so many countries???

WOW!!!

Indian_Duke schrieb:

square_wave schrieb: you could have bought Viren’s interconnect / spk cables or Murthy’s entry/mid level interconnect with entry/mid level spk cables from kimber, Qed etc….These are designed keeping audio in mind by people who know what they are doing. Are you saying that Nordost, Kimber, Audioquest, Straightwire, XLO, et all have no idea what they are doing and yet managed to fool so many "seasoned" audiophiles in so many countries??? WOW!!!

Nope. They all know how to make cables. But they won’t give you the really good ones unless you pay through your nose.
There is too much fluff and magic in the cable industry. Lot of purple prose advertising claims. I am not saying cables do not make a difference. They do. From my experience, it takes really hi-end cables to beat locally made stuff done by people who know how to do it. Saying that entry level cables made by so-called fluff and magic brands are better is contrary to my experience. It is quite contrary to the experience by the audiophile group I hang out with too. Everybody has their experience and they talk from their experience. I can only talk from my experience right ?
I think I made myself clear.

No No Sir;

You got it wrong.

The problem lies in Mr. Muthys marketing abilities;
He [Murthy] has been successful at making a 'great cable' but has been very very unsuccessful at marketing it !!!

Hence none of the 'seasoned' audiophile have not 'recognised' the 'genious' of the man as yet !!!!

I am sure that all the persons that are useing or have auditioned the cables [Mr. Murthy's] were ex clients of Transparent / Nordost / Kimber / Cardas / Purist Audio Design etc. Please do note that I am not talking about Red Dawn / Music Wave / 4 TC etc. or the likes. I am sure they must have been reference level cables for sure.

Pictures of the test being done - if put on the forum - would be truly appreciated !!!

oops, I almost forgot to mention my favourite - all time - vdH [bland and dull] & our own Siltech [Indian Owner] in the list from above !!!

bhagwan69 schrieb:

Pictures of the test being done - if put on the forum - would be truly appreciated !!!

Picture and sound both..pleeese

abhi.pani schrieb:

bhagwan69 schrieb: Pictures of the test being done - if put on the forum - would be truly appreciated !!!images/smilies/insane.gif Picture and sound both..pleeese :*

Sorry Abhi !! Sound cannot be put up;
Pictures of the cables - 1 against the other - Set ups used for evaluation etc. would make the claim a bit more believable. Just a suggestion.

Interestingly, do these cables have a web site ? Can I at least see them some where ? Maybe audition them if possible ? Truly, I am a full supporter of Indian Hi-Fi. If the cable is as good as you say it is, I would be extatic and will recommend it to others.

Do let me know if a demo / audition would be possible. Thanks.

bhagwan69 schrieb:

No No Sir; You got it wrong. The problem lies in Mr. Muthys marketing abilities; He [Murthy] has been successful at making a 'great cable' but has been very very unsuccessful at marketing it !!! Hence none of the 'seasoned' audiophile have not 'recognised' the 'genious' of the man as yet !!!! I am sure that all the persons that are useing or have auditioned the cables [Mr. Murthy's] were ex clients of Transparent / Nordost / Kimber / Cardas / Purist Audio Design etc. Please do note that I am not talking about Red Dawn / Music Wave / 4 TC etc. or the likes. I am sure they must have been reference level cables for sure. Pictures of the test being done - if put on the forum - would be truly appreciated !!!

Totally agree with you sir.
About pictures I do not know. He does not market his stuff well. When you get into marketing cables you get into a different level of competition. He sells by word of mouth.
I agree with your observation on VDH………Good tone control for overly bright systems.

abhi.pani schrieb:

2. My neighbour's wife was not good enough.

Sirji,

Pictures ?
Audition Possible ?
Can a set be sent ? I could make a deposit [refundable] payment. I want to test it in my set up.
I would need 02 sets of interconnects [Balanced] & 1 set of speaker cable [single wire] 3M long. If he makes power cords, then I shall need 6 of them with Euro Schucko Termination.

Please do try and let me know !!! Your efforts would be appreciated.

Does he [Mr. Murthy] have a web site ? Product Details ? Specifications ?

Its been ages since I saw a nice Cable fight. especially the ones that end with "to each his own"

Now that a landmark dcision has been reached, Can we start with power chords ?

Dear ARJ,

Sir,

I am here to support the local manufacturers ! If they make a good product, let it be known. It is never wrong to pit one against the other, if the result is conclusive, we all are better off.

If any so called audiophile chooses to close his ears to what he has heard, he is the looser.

Let us assume, that if Mr. M's cables out perform my current cables, I will sell my current cables off on Audiogon & purchase Mr. M's cables & I might just be a little bit richer [fingers are crossed].
I am ready to give a full deposit for the products so long as they have a 30 day full refund option attached to them.

I could even go 1 step further;

Get the cables from Mr. M. Use them in my set up & then take it to the houses of different forum members in Mumbai. Let them all use it against their own set of cables & request them to write a report on the forum.
How does the idea sound ? Suggestions ?

Bhagwan69sirji, i did not intend to point any finger at you...just the lovely sanskrit verses being recited by Sq and Abhi

really looking forward to your results.

bhagwan69 schrieb:

Sirji, Pictures ? Audition Possible ? Can a set be sent ? I could make a deposit [refundable] payment. I want to test it in my set up. I would need 02 sets of interconnects [Balanced] & 1 set of speaker cable [single wire] 3M long. If he makes power cords, then I shall need 6 of them with Euro Schucko Termination. Please do try and let me know !!! Your efforts would be appreciated. Does he [Mr. Murthy] have a web site ? Product Details ? Specifications ?

Let me check with Murthy if this can be done…………..Will PM you.
No website.

Which cables do you use right now ? Are they top of the line branded ones ? Remember, I was comparing M’s cables to mid-level branded cables. Recent comparison was to an audience cable costing around 30k or something. I really do not know how they compare to cables costing a bomb.

Thank You S.W.

I am serious, it would be interesting, but I will need the full set, else the system synergy will get disrupted & it shall not be a correct comparison.

Please do p.m. for details.

Its been ages since I saw a nice Cable fight.

Ah..cmon, we were not fighting...just chatting.. .

Can we start with power chords ?

Aap shuru karo...hum toh hain hi saath dene ke liye..

Arj schrieb:

Its been ages since I saw a nice Cable fight. especially the ones that end with "to each his own" Now that a landmark dcision has been reached, Can we start with power chords ? :prost

LOL

Actually i had posted pics of the jumpers long time back...almost 2 years ago..

SW wrote

I agree with your observation on VDH………Good tone control for overly bright systems.

If the interconnects are not acting as tone controls how can each one of them have different sonics ?

Can anyone please throw more light on this.

quote="Indian_Duke"][quote="square_wave"]you could have bought Viren’s interconnect / spk cables or Murthy’s entry/mid level interconnect with entry/mid level spk cables from kimber, Qed etc….These are designed keeping audio in mind by people who know what they are doing. [/quote]




Are you saying that Nordost, Kimber, Audioquest, Straightwire, XLO, et all have no idea what they are doing and yet managed to fool so many "seasoned" audiophiles in so many countries???

WOW!!![/quote]

Nope. They all know how to make cables. But they won’t give you the really good ones unless you pay through your nose.
There is too much fluff and magic in the cable industry. Lot of purple prose advertising claims. I am not saying cables do not make a difference. They do. From my experience, it takes really hi-end cables to beat locally made stuff done by people who know how to do it. Saying that entry level cables made by so-called fluff and magic brands are better is contrary to my experience. It is quite contrary to the experience by the audiophile group I hang out with too. Everybody has their experience and they talk from their experience. I can only talk from my experience right ?
I think I made myself clear.[/quote]

That's strange. You seem to be backtracking now. Your earlier posting mentioned you favoured Mr. M's cables since "they were designed keeping audio in mind by people who know what they are doing". This clearly means the big brands do not know what they are doing and do not have audio on their mind while designing and manufacturing their stuff.

Your subsequent postings in response to Mr. Bhagwan69 also raise the following questions in my mind:

1. Does Mr. M design and manufacture the cable and the connectors himself? If yes, what designing, manufacturing and testing facilities does he have? I am sure we all would be interested to know more.

2. If no to the above, then does he procure a roll of cable and the connectors from the market, and with devilish expertise, solder/crimp them together to such great effect?

3. Taking a slightly different tack, since you say Mr. M does not indulge in any marketing exercise and relies solely upon word of mouth to sell his products, his scale of operations would be very very small, thereby denying him the purchasing advantage that economies of scale bring about. Therefore, the material he uses would be really inexpensive to begin with?

4. Instead of just saying entry and mid level, can you name the particular cables from Kimber, Straightwire etc, etc, which you found inferior to Mr. M's entry level cable? And in what way?

5. Instead of just citing some nameless "audiophile group", can you let us know more about the audio equipment they own so that we can have a better picture of their level of "seasoning" and credibility?

My intention is not to belittle Mr. M in any way, but just to get a more complete perspective. Remember, although you keep going gaga about these cables, they did absolutely zilch for 2 other forum members. If they really are so good I too would like to know more about, and possibly own them.

ani schrieb:

SW wrote I agree with your observation on VDH………Good tone control for overly bright systems. If the interconnects are not acting as tone controls how can each one of them have different sonics ? Can anyone please throw more light on this.

Dear Ani,
I have something to say here. I have tried more than 10 different ICs in my system in the last one year and all of them were standard ICs (not very entry level) from their respective brands. Yes, all of them did something noticeable to the tones. The sound I got from each was either bright or dull or balanced but slightly muffled or clinical or slightly thin, some even sounded unnecessarily thick (Mr.M's IC) and then one sounded a bit forward etc etc. But the one IC which totally blew me away was the Audioquest Jaguar (32V DBS). This was one cable which did nothing to upset the tonality (at least I couldnt make out any tonal change from what is just about expected)....but the greatest thing it did to my system was, it cleaned up the sound like anything.
Now how do i describe that.. ...There was an instant reaction of "WOW what has happened to the sound!!!". It didnt add anything to the bass, mids or highs...but the air between the instruments were starkly dark and I could almost measure the distance between two instruments. The background was super dark. Suddenly I realized how big was the stage because now I could almost figure out the boundaries of the stage and also the boundary and size of each instrument in the space which was previously somewhat fuzzy, bloated and never so sharp. With the other ICs I tried the air between the instruments were narrowed and also filled with some fuzzy noise (cant be made out unless you clean up the noise) and that never allowed me go very loud without fatigue. Now this IC came in and it was a total turn around. My wife, who never knew (till date) that a new IC is connected suddenly started praising the system and ended up listening 5 CDs in a go. I told her, its the result of burning in (I had a new BM6 then) . But the actual hero was this IC and I was delighted. All my audiophile friends who had heard my system before were almost stunned by this improvement. And incidentally no one commented on the tonal improvement but all of them said its exceptionally clean sound without any emphasis to any spectrum of audio frequencies. Its like you make a brand new car stand out side on the road, you come back after 15-20 mins and you see your car still shining until you just touch it with your fingers and you see a thin layer of dust on it, the actual car (behind the dust) is much more beautiful...thats the effect I got with my IC.

I really dont know whether to call it a tone control buddy .

I know this is going to fan the flames or rather then embers ..but i happened to take a look at the soldering in the jumper cables. The first one was bad and shoddy..and i know shoddy when i see it cause i have been there myself for over a year. Thankfully my soldering has got much better(even did some smd work this last month) .

The second pair however were much better.

The RCA plugs for those concerend were nickel plated( i think) MX ones. About 70 Rs a pair or thereabouts.

The jumpers themselves(3.5 inches long) were priced at 750rs(maybe 700). You would probably have better results with the Tara Labs jumpers..give them both a shot. If i didn't hear a difference doesn't mean you will not.

Get them on a loan or a demo if you can, that way you will be able to judge them without being prejudiced. As some people will refuse to believe that there is no improvement simply because they spent money on it(this especially includes me. So, don't take this as personal affront and flame me.
This happens a often and the same prejudiced opinion(Guilty again here) is repeated on forums endlessly and with great vigour.

Let us feel free to express our opinions on a forum such as this. While we reserve the right to praise we reserve the right to castigate as well.

AS for now...going back to listening to MJQ...Thanks again Manek. Looking forward to listening to Pyramid.

No question of unnecessary flaming here.

I think it is in everybody's interest that a balanced view is projected here, and on any other forum. Some of the emphatic utterances fly in the face of logic, at least to me. Reek of surreptitious advertising. Maybe I am wrong and it is plain naivette. Either way, not very healthy...